Interview with Eric Jung, an International Product Manager at Amazon, Japan

This is the 18th interview in the “Interviews with Foreign Information Technology Engineers in Japan” series. “ EJable.com’s Ryoko Nagai talks to Eric Jung, an International Product Manager at Amazon, Japan. You may check out more interviews with IT professionals in Japan.

Video Interview with Eric

Transcript of Eric’s Interview

Ryoko: Thank you, Eric, for joining us today at EJable.

I’m very excited to hear about your stories here in Japan since you’ve been here in two different stages of your life, if I may say that.

So, if you could begin with your introduction, I’d be very happy to start the interview.

Eric: Absolutely, nice to meet you, everyone.

My name is Eric. I’m currently a senior technical product manager at one of the major tech companies here in Tokyo.

I’ve actually recently returned to Japan for the second time in my life. I started my career in Japan back in 2013 and stayed here till 2015.

After spending some time back in the United States, where I came from, I felt it was the right time to return to Japan, personally and professionally. So, I moved back about 3-4 months ago. Since then, I’ve been very happy with my choice to return to Japan.

Ryoko: OK. And what brought you back to Japan this time after such a long period away from Japan?

Eric: Yeah, so currently, you know, as a senior product manager at Amazon Japan, I actually had a choice to relocate to New York or Tokyo from Los Angeles, where I spent about three years working in the LA office.  

Ryoko: OK.

Eric: So, when it was time for me to sort of make a decision, I thought about which city would give me, you know, a better quality of life, both internal real growth and personal life. And then, you know, I was able to decide to come to Japan.

Personally, I think Tokyo is one of the top cities in the world. It is the biggest metropolitan area in the world. But despite that reputation, I think it offers a really great environment to raise a family with a relatively reasonable cost of living,

I recently became a father, actually. I am now a father of a small baby, and having access to childcare, daycare, convenience, and safety as a young parent are really big factors when deciding where to live and where to work, and Tokyo offers all that.

Also, there are so many places to travel in Japan.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: As a young parent, you have to think about what it would be like traveling with kids. Yeah. And optimally. And in Japan, beyond Tokyo, there are a lot of great places and fun things to do. But, even without having to take a plane, there are so many great places and things to do in Tokyo, which is convenient for a young parent. So, personally, I was really excited about moving to Tokyo, knowing that I’d be a parent.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: And career-wise, I think Tokyo and Japan offer exciting career growth opportunities.

Ryoko: OK.

Eric: In the States, many industries are scattered around different cities. For example, New York tends to focus on the financial and fashion industries. LA has more entertainment, and San Francisco and Seattle have more big tech companies.

So, if you want to work in a particular field, you must move to different parts of the country. So, I think Tokyo is a really exciting choice for the career because it has all the major industries in one place.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm, yeah.

Eric: So, you know, whether it’s about your desire to move around the different industries in different companies or have access to many different worlds without having to move around, and Tokyo gives you those choices.

Ryoko: Right. Yeah. And what did you think about the difference in the working culture between New York and Tokyo? Is it something very different or not so much?

Eric: I think that’s a that’s a really good question. You know, in a sense, they’re both very similar: two of the largest and fastest cities. But in terms of the people, you meet after work, hmm, that’s where it gets interesting.

Back in the US, because each city is so limited to a specific industry, your social life is also tied to people from that industry.

That’s why I really like life in Tokyo: You get to meet, hang out, and interact with people from different backgrounds. So, I think that’s a part of life in Tokyo that I really enjoy in terms of both professional and personal life.

Ryoko: Yeah, that’s great. Could you then explain more about your position as a product manager?

Eric: Yeah, I’m really passionate about product management. I’ve developed this career since I came to Japan.

I didn’t know what product management was until I came to Tokyo or Japan in 2013. I really got to learn about different fields in the IT industry, and it became interesting enough to develop my interest in growing as a product manager.

So, it was a really good learning experience for me. Product management is a role that bridges the gap between customers and the engineering team.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: Each company has a limited number of engineers. How do we make decisions with those limited engineers to prioritize what has the most impact on our business?

You know, we may have ideas that it would be nice to add this or that feature or function to our website, but unfortunately, we have limited time and limited human resources.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: Yes, I mean engineering resources, you know, data analysts, etc. Product management is about how you work with the business and engineering teams to decide.

Product managers make decisions about which projects to prioritize for the maximum impact on the company.

It’s a really popular tech career in the States.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm. Right.

Eric: However, this role is slightly less established in Japan, and there is a growing need for good product managers there.

This is especially true in markets like Japan, a big market that all the companies in the world want to try to win, but which is unique and has a high barrier to entry, both in terms of language and cultural barriers.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: You know, more and more global companies are looking to hire good product managers to meet the Japanese market’s needs. So, it’s really exciting for me as a product manager in Japan.

Ryoko: You touched upon the need to learn Japanese here. As a product manager in a big global company, do you use Japanese in your day-to-day work?

Eric: That’s a really good question. You know, I think the answer is, “It depends.”

If you’re working more with the internal teams, mostly within engineering teams, who don’t necessarily have to be Japanese, then you don’t necessarily have to be fluent in Japanese. In such cases, the expectation that you should speak Japanese is much lower.

In my case, I learned Japanese when I was young and have business-level fluency in Japanese, which is helping me a lot.

Ryoko: OK.

Eric: It is not a requirement, but I try to speak in Japanese as much as possible with our business team because many of our business team members’ native languages are not English. Therefore, it would work better if I spoke in Japanese with them. But with the engineering team, I speak in English.

Ryoko: OK. Mm-hmm.

Eric: And that has been a good mix for me.

Ryoko: I see. I’m just curious—I’m sure the people watching this will also be curious—about whether a product manager needs a background in business and engineering.

Eric: Umm, that’s a really good question. You know it’s a $1 million question.

It would be ideal to have a background in engineering and business. But the reality is that most people start their careers either from the business or engineering side and then slowly transition.

In my case, I came from the business side and acquired more technical skills through grad school as I pursued a master’s program in data analytics.

Ryoko: OK.

Eric: Many analysts or data scientists have transitioned from business to data to product management. Many people come from a software engineering or data science background, either by attending business school or working closely with the business team. They transition to product management, which requires both, which helps. It is helpful to have both sides of the skills.

Ryoko: Great. To discuss your career in Japan a bit more, do you have any goals for yourself during your stay?

Eric: Yeah, that’s a good question. The goal now is to specialize in the product’s internationalization. I’ve gained valuable skills back in the States, but unfortunately, I could not focus on my Japanese background. In Japanese, it’s called Mottainai, but really speaking, I feel a little bit ashamed that I didn’t get to utilize my Japanese experience and the familiarity with the Japanese language and culture, which I gained during two-plus years in my 20s working in Japan, in the US.  

Ryoko: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Eric: When I came to Japan this time, I wanted to build and launch features for the Japanese market. I’d also like to grow my expertise in product internationalization through my career in Japan, which I could not do during the last time. That was my first time in Japan.

Ryoko: OK.

Well, so, another topic!

I’m a bit curious because many people I’ve interviewed mentioned that it’s hard to find good friends in Japan because, you know, the local Japanese people tend to be reserved. Therefore, foreigners tend to have friends with foreigners like you. Have you kept in touch with your coworkers with whom you used to work back in 2013?

Eric: That’s a very good question.

To me, that was one of the biggest reasons for my lack of fear of moving back to Japan. The friendships that I made during my first time in Japan have become lifelong friendships.

When I first came to Japan, I was still in my mid-20s, and I think it’s always easier to make new friendships when you are younger.

Ryoko: Yes.

Eric: In the company I joined then, many like-minded people were in the same age group. People who moved to a new country were seeking new friends because they didn’t have family and friends here in Japan. It really created an environment where I want to make friends, you know, in Japan.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: This could be very different from country to country. For example, in the States, there is a clear boundary between people with whom you interact during work and people with whom you hang out after work. Yeah, so you know, you try to avoid being too close or too open to your coworkers. In the States, people tend to go home right away to spend time with their real friends and family.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: From my first experience in Japan, what’s nice about Japan is that there is a lot of mix. For example, my work friends became my close friends outside of work. And I think it’s also because the culture in Japan is like that, you know. Japanese people go out for drinks with their coworkers, play tennis on weekends, and enjoy hobbies together.

Ryoko: That’s true.

Eric: I can give you a really good example. My wife is one of the ex-coworkers whom I met in my first company.

Ryoko: Wow.

Eric: Both she and I liked Japanese pop culture and Japan as such.

We enjoyed Japan so much that we decided to take a job and move there. Because we shared the background of being Asian Americans and working together, we were able to become really close. Then, you know, we started dating and got married. Now we’re back here. So, you know, I mean, that’s one example. But I have also kept in touch with many other friends I’ve met in Japan.

Ryoko: Sounds very nice.

OK, have you seen any major changes in the market? What kind of people are there in Japan now compared to when you were here in 2013?

Eric: Yeah, I think that’s a really good question, but it’s also difficult to tell because I got older. So, for me, it was also growing and changing personally, but it’s definitely the number of foreigners. Yeah, foreign workers have grown since 2013.

Ryoko: Right.

Eric: Back in 2013, there were very rare opportunities for recent college graduates to be given a visa sponsorship for work visa.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: Back then, there were a lot of senior executives, and it was quite difficult for young professionals to get visa sponsorship to move to Japan. But I’ve seen that those hurdles have gotten, you know, maybe less of a bottleneck.

Ryoko: Yeah, yeah.

Eric: There is also a lot more diversity in the people’s backgrounds in terms of their countries.

Ryoko: Oh, OK.

Eric: Yeah. So, I think we see quite a positive change.

On the flip side, there’s a new concern about the yen’s weakness. Yeah, it’s not as strong as before. So, it became more of a concern for people to move here compared to 10 years ago. Earlier, it was less of a barrier to making a decision to come to Japan because.

Ryoko: Yeah.

Eric: The yen has definitely been stronger than it is now.

However, I believe, based on my personal experience, if it’s about staying in your home country, whether you know in the States, India, or China, wherever you’re from versus taking an opportunity to challenge yourself in Japan in a new country, I do think the experience goes way beyond the money or the salary that you can get. I want to utilize my experience in Japan to advance my career.

So, yeah, I think you can gain a lot more than the pure numeric value you get.

Ryoko: Yeah, I see. Do you have any advice or tips for young professionals who are considering going to Japan or looking for a job there?

Eric: Yeah, absolutely.

Of course, staying in your home country versus moving to Japan for a new challenge is a very big decision. It could be very scary. However, I think it’s definitely worth the challenge, especially in the long term. So, I would consider the positive side of taking it as a challenge, yeah.

One of the most important things to make that a success is to envision a clear objective or goal for 2, 3, or 5 years. Japan is really comfortable and fun. It is a convenient country where you know that people can enjoy both work and life.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: But it could also mean that many years can pass quickly. So, a set goal helps you achieve what you want by coming and working in Japan.

Ryoko: Yeah, yeah.

Eric: For me, what I wanted to achieve in Japan the last time was to apply to a business school after two or three years in Japan. I thought I would stand out among the many great candidates, and it would make my story more interesting when applying to top business schools. That was my goal even before coming to Japan. I had even started to prepare—this is what I’m going to write in my essays, this is what I’m going to achieve in two years, etc.

Ryoko: Yeah.

Eric: Yeah, obviously, that doesn’t have to be your goal. It could be anything like taking the JLPT, or, you know, making or saving X amount of money, or changing jobs after two years. I think it’s always good to have a set goal for 2-3 years so you can look back and say, oh, you know, by moving to Japan, I was able to achieve these XYZ things.

Ryoko: Great. Thank you for that advice. Then, maybe you can move on to just a bit of the social part of your life here in Japan.

You mentioned that Japan and Tokyo are fun places to be. So, are there things you like to do in your free time? Maybe it’s a bit difficult now that you have a very young baby, but yeah, what do you like to do in your free time?

Eric: Oh yeah, one of the things I did last year before moving to Japan was travel to different parts of Japan. Through bullet trains or Shinkansen. I think Japan is one of the best, if not the best, in terms of train travel.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm.

Eric: Especially as a non-Japanese citizen or foreigner, you have access to JR Pass, which is unlimited, right? Yeah. So, I really enjoyed it. Going on trips, you know, to the Tohoku region, all the way to Aomori. I took a really beautiful scenic train and traveled for about seven days straight.

Another time I came, I traveled to Kansai using the train; I traveled to Hokuriku using the train, which was a fantastic time.

Because I used to live in Tokyo, I wanted to experience different parts of Japan, and those have been the most fun. I hope to enjoy those long-distance trips even with the kids.

I like train trips through Japan because there are also many trains that are convenient for traveling with family.

Ryoko: Yeah.

Ryoko: Many people imagine Tokyo to be busy, crowded, and maybe overwhelming. How do you feel about the busyness in Tokyo?

Eric: That’s interesting. You know, I think one of the reasons why Tokyo seems very busy is that many trains are above the ground 😊. But you know, on the other hand, compared to many major cities in the world, Tokyo, for the size of the city, doesn’t have that many cars, especially as compared to New York or LA, where cars are everywhere, and there are a lot of traffic jams.

Ryoko: Oh, really?

Eric: Even compared to closer cities like Seoul or other major Asian cities, there are fewer cars. So, I do feel like Tokyo is busy, but it could also be very quiet as long as you are not next to any major train station 😊

Ryoko: Yeah 😊

Eric: I actually enjoy the quiet side of Tokyo very often. And yeah, it depends on where you come from, but Tokyo is not as busy or as loud as you may think.

Ryoko: Mm-hmm. Then maybe my last question is, are there any things related to Japanese culture or other things that you’ve grown to like or dislike?

Eric: Hmm. Things which I have grown to like or dislike? 😊 Well, I guess one of the things is the dining experience in Japan, which is so fantastic. Yeah, you know, eating out in Japan could be really fun. It could be very affordable but very luxurious.

Ryoko: OK.

Eric: For example, in the States, there’s a culture of tipping the waiters despite not-so-good service 😊.

Ryoko: Yeah 😊.

Eric: In Japan, you know, if you go to a small mom-and-pop shop or fine dining, there are no tips.

I’ve been enjoying the dining experiences. That being said, I think the dining experience can still be very overwhelming for foreigners because many authentic Japanese places don’t have menus in English or other languages, or they don’t have pictures. And I think in the US, many menus have pictures.

So, you know this: even with a language barrier, there’s a way to get around

I’m trying to learn more Japanese so that I have no problem enjoying all the good dining experiences in Japan. But sometimes it’s hard because, you know, it’s all in Kanji.

Ryoko: Yeah, that’s great. That was it from my side. Is there something you would like to share with me?

Eric: Yeah. I mean, uh, yeah. Thanks for the opportunity. Feel free to connect with me via LinkedIn or reach out to me via LinkedIn if you’re interested in learning more about tech careers or product management in Japan. I would love to provide my first-hand experience. So yeah, I’m looking forward to meeting new people.

Ryoko: Thank you so much for your time.

Eric: Thank you. Have a great day.

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